Research

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    • I want to know where everyone is at in the game regarding research as the title says.. Post your RP's an hour, Scientists score, and your current technologies you are working on. :scientifique:

      Scientists: 1,907,737
      RP Per Hour: 3,342.31 (4,010.77 with 20% ambrosia booster)

      Currently Working On.....
      • Level 8 Seafaring (I can research this now)
      • Level 8 Economy (I can research this now)
      • Level 8 Military (I can research this now)
      • Level 14 Science (45 Days without experiments)
    • i stopped all research, and tore down most of my academies, but when i ended i had researched all futures up to and including level 6. i find that going to war, the cost to benefit ratio isn't there especially since i use the Theocracy government .

      Did you know 9 out of 10 times, when people quote statistics, they just made up the numbers?

      Thank You :love: VAL :love: for the Hella cool signature !!!!!
    • If you do that you should leave 1 academy with optician so you can still do experiments. Optimally speaking for any contingencies anyways. Strictly speaking you could of left your academies up (if you don't need the building space, also one of the largest building score buildings) and left your scientists fired until you wanted them.


      My buildings guide -- My 0 Military Defense Guide
      * @Lissala slaps ImperialUser around a bit with a large trout
    • Whitbis wrote:

      i stopped all research, and tore down most of my academies, but when i ended i had researched all futures up to and including level 6. i find that going to war, the cost to benefit ratio isn't there especially since i use the Theocracy government .
      You are wrong there. If you are a fighter then researching Sea and Military as high as possible is very beneficial. With my level 20 Military Research I get 52 % discount in costs and my Level 16 Sea gives me 44 % discount which adds up in big savings.
    • my friend did the math, and due to the cost of the scientist plus the fact that you don't gain gold from those people, times the amount of time it takes to do the research, you would have millions of gold for the 2% reduction per level...

      so for ships future level 7, you need 3,729,600 research points, now each of my towns had level 25 academies, which means 256 scientist, with my research perks, they would generate 306 research points per hour, or... each scientist did 1.195, so say 1.2 research points per hour. so it would cost 3,108,000 scientist hours to gather the next level... so 10 towns at level 25 academy, would take 1214 hours to do the research ( about 50 days ). so it costs 6 gold per scientist, or 6gold* (252 scientist * 10 towns) * 1214 hours. which is 18,355,680 gold... spent... had you not had them doing research, they could have been making gold, at a rate of 3 gold per hour...or 9,177,840 lost in gold production + 18,355,680 gold spent = 27,533,520 gold lost in research, how long would that take for you to recoup at 2% reduced upkeep? and that is only on either navy or army, double it to get the benefit for both, and that is only for futures level 7... it goes up each future research, starting at 532,800 for level 1.

      so each progressive future takes longer to realize any benefit due to the additional costs. my current reduction is -26%, but only 12% of that is due to futures levels.



      now for the mind blowing part... each future cost 532,800 more then the last, so level 2 is 2* 532,800 + 532,800... or 3x so in the example of a level 20...you can figure it out by doing 20+19+18 ect = 210 * 532,800 or 111,888,000 research points, if we figure out at 1.2 per scientist hour ( not sure we want the nightmare of figuring how much it cost to get a higher productivity) and the cost to you at 6 gold per scientist per hour... also the gold they lost due to working and not sitting around....

      it cost 839,160,000 gold in either expenses to pay a scientist or lost gold production. to get 52% reduction in upkeep....

      Did you know 9 out of 10 times, when people quote statistics, they just made up the numbers?

      Thank You :love: VAL :love: for the Hella cool signature !!!!!

      The post was edited 1 time, last by Whitbis ().

    • heck, someone needs to take this calculator away from me....

      so, say you have a huge army, which costs 200,000 gold in upkeep at -54% cost reduction, that would be 108,000 gold in savings per hour. to get to the future, it would have cost 839,160,000 gold, / 108,000 per hour would take 7770 hours to get even , or 323.75 days until you started to show a profit or benefit from the research.

      Did you know 9 out of 10 times, when people quote statistics, they just made up the numbers?

      Thank You :love: VAL :love: for the Hella cool signature !!!!!

      The post was edited 1 time, last by Whitbis ().

    • Less then a year is well within that time frame. Most people play an online game they like for 2+ years. Don't forget you can also do experiments and the cost per research plummets drastically.

      (added)
      Gold production is also a limiting factor for the size of your army, so someone with a higher future can have a larger military.


      My buildings guide -- My 0 Military Defense Guide
      * @Lissala slaps ImperialUser around a bit with a large trout
    • Whitbis wrote:

      heck, someone needs to take this calculator away from me....

      so, say you have a huge army, which costs 200,000 gold in upkeep at -54% cost reduction, that would be 108,000 gold in savings per hour. to get to the future, it would have cost 839,160,000 gold, / 108,000 per hour would take 7770 hours to get even , or 323.75 days until you started to show a profit or benefit from the research.
      It cost a whole lot less than that, my friend. These are my stats:
      Player: sanmeet
      Ally:-
      Points:13,795,367
      Master builders:8,559,010
      Scientists:5,147,161
      Military:51,381
      Gold stock:90,060,514


      Out of my 5 Million + scientists almost 80-85 % of them I have researched this year. The fact that I have won 13 Piracy contests overall so far helps in a big way. Plus I am an aggresive pillager and all the extra resources I convert in big chunks to glass and get experiments done to speed up the points process.

      I am aiming for almost 60 % discount in both military and navy in the next year. :D
    • yeah, if you have access to a lot of crystal, then you take a huge chunk of that off the board, but i don't find a huge surplus falling into my lap at this time. thing is, that is basically the only way of really making it cost effective.

      Did you know 9 out of 10 times, when people quote statistics, they just made up the numbers?

      Thank You :love: VAL :love: for the Hella cool signature !!!!!
    • The thing with scientists is, how long will you plaqy this game for. You guysb have played for ages to get to where you are but many are not like that, and may leave the game, so I never reccomend scientists.


      Thank you Carter & Crosswind

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    • Scientists: 3,260
      Research Points per Hour: 4,836.20
      Future Techs I have complete:
      Seafaring: 5
      Economy: 9
      Science: 14
      Military: 9

      about 2/3 of the way toward Science 15


      On the use of crystal

      Building with basic researches and a level 32 Optician
      .54 Crystal = .01 Master Builder points
      1 Master Builder point = 54 Crystal

      Building without an Optician
      .86 Crystal = .01 Master Builder points
      1 Master Builder point = 86 Crystal

      Doing Experiments with a level 32 Optician
      300,000 Crystal = 220589 research points = 4411.78 Scientist points
      1 Scientist point = 68 Crystal

      Clearly, if you are going to be doing experiments in a town, it is worth having an Optician, so I am not going to look at the cost of doing them without.

      The most efficient way to gain points from Crystal is to build with it, building a Dump or Academy level in a town with a level 32 Optician.

      Of course, if you are building a Dump in a town with no Optician, but a Fireworks Test Area and possibly other reduction buildings, you are probably getting a better overall deal than with experiments still.

      If you are looking for points, building an Academy is better than doing experiments, whether or not you end up using that Academy.


      Now, on to whether research in Academies or experiments is better.

      With no science future tech levels, but with all basic research complete
      1 scientist = 1.14 research points/hr. = 6 gold/hr. (you pay 3 gold/hr. to keep him working, and he would give you 3 gold/hr. if he were idle)
      1.14 research = 6 gold
      .0228 Scientist points = 6 gold
      1 Scientist point = 263.158 gold doing research

      from above, we already know that 1 Scientist point = 68 Crystal doing experiments.

      If 68 Crystal = 263.158 gold
      1 Crystal = 3.87 gold
      research and experiments are equally efficient.

      If crystal is cheaper, experiments are more efficient. If crystal is more expensive, research with scientists is more efficient.


      With Future Science Tech 8:
      1 scientist = 1.3 research points/hr. = 6 gold
      1.3 research = 6 gold
      .026 Scientist points = 6 gold
      1 Scientist point = 230.769 gold
      68 Crystal = 230.769 gold
      1 Crystal = 3.394 gold is the point at which research and experiments are equally efficient.

      This means that if your marginal cost for crystal, the price you are paying for additional crystal for research or building purposes, is above the value determined by your future tech level, you should employ all possible scientists before doing experiments. So if you are purchasing crystal through your trading post or using Helping Hands for crystal, using scientists is a more efficient way to produce Scientist points than experiments.

      1 scientist = 1.14 + .02f research points/hr. = 6 gold, where f is the future tech level

      .02(1.14 + .02f) Scientist Points = 6 gold
      1 Scientist point = 68 crystal = 6/(.02)(1.14 + .02f) = 300/(1.14 + .02f) gold
      1 crystal = 4.412/(1.14 + .02f) gold


      Science
      Future Break even
      Tech cost for
      Level Crystal (to make experiments as efficient as research)

      0 3.870
      1 3.803
      2 3.739
      3 3.676
      4 3.616
      5 3.558
      6 3.501
      7 3.447
      8 3.394
      9 3.342
      10 3.292
      11 3.244
      12 3.197
      13 3.151
      14 3.107
      15 3.064
      16 3.022
      17 2.981
      18 2.941
      19 2.903
      20 2.865
      21 2.828
      22 2.792
      23 2.758
      24 2.723
      25 2.690

      To put it another way, doing research with scientists is the equivalent of buying crystal at the cost listed, based on your future tech, and applying that crystal directly to small experiments with immediate results. If you think that is a worthwhile price for crystal, then put your scientists to work buying it at that price.

      I should add that a hidden cost of experiments is shipping crystal. The effect of scientists is that of delivering the crystal directly to the town that needs it, one with a level 32 Optician.
    • automeris wrote:

      1 scientist = 1.14 research points/hr. = 6 gold/hr. (you pay 3 gold/hr. to keep him working, and he would give you 3 gold/hr. if he were idle)


      Are you sure about the cost in Gold per hour for each scientist? The in-game help states:

      Every researcher costs 6 gold per hour


      Which would make the total opportunity cost per scientist 9 Gold per hour.

      Other than that, I give you a double-thumbs-up for your logic. :thumbsup:
      "It is your fate, forgetfulness. All the old lessons of life, you lose and gain and lose and gain again." --Leto II